Shocked

I'm not feeling so good today, and it's not just the sinus cold. I spent a lot of time on Twitter over the weekend following eyewitness feeds of what was going on in Toronto at the G20/G8 protests. First I was horrified at the disgusting things some of the extreme protesters were doing. But then, as Saturday night went on and Sunday wore away, it was the way the police were treating peaceful protesters and random bystanders that was most disturbing.

We know, every time there's a G20/G8 meeting that there are going to be rioting/vandalizing protesters. I feel so much sadness for the cities that are forced to host these meetings, because the lunatics show up just to destroy things and get an adrenaline rush out of yelling at people.

But then, even once they were shut down, the police just lost perspective, or maybe the people telling the police what to do lost perspective, and started detaining and arresting people just for being in their own neighborhoods.

We've seen it before, I know. But what really scares me most of all about the human rights abuses in Toronto this past weekend is that it's Canada.

At one point, the awesome Ann Douglas (author of the "The Mother of All" series) who tweets at @anndouglas tweeted "Remember how smug we all felt when Bush was in power in the US - how we said that could never happen in Canada? Yeah." and I realized that was exactly why it was freaking me out so much.

To me, it felt like our whole country was falling apart when George W Bush was President. (I know it feels that way for other Americans now that Barack Obama is President.) And especially having lived in NYC during 9/11, it just feels like we're always a short jump away from chaos. And like we really never know what's going to happen, because we're not an essentially civilized people. We're too polarized and angry and extreme.

But Canada seemed different. The Canadians I know are witty and intelligent and driven and self-deprecating and productive. And the whole country just seems more measured and civilized than the US is. Less prone to go off half-cocked about something that should really be people's private business, or start fights with other countries, or just stick their noses where they don't belong in general.

Canada was also this safe place we could go if the shit really hit the fan here in the US, because it was safe and reasonable there.

So on Saturday and yesterday when downtown Toronto was anything BUT safe and reasonable, for random Canadian citizens and visitors who were doing things like walking their dogs or meeting friends to go out and have a drink, everything fell apart. For the people who were detained and arrested and stripped of their rights, for sure, but also for everyone else, in Canada and in the US and in other countries.

Because if even Canada can descend into Lord of the Flies in a hot second, what hope is there for any of us?

Comments

[Ann Douglas]

Thank you for writing about this, Moxie. Your perspective is (as always) so wise.

[twitter.com/DoorbellQueen]

Yes. YES. That's it, exactly.

[Neil]

I think, more than anything, this weekend just proves that we Canadians are all just as capable as anyone else of feats of incredible stupidity, groupthink, and mob rule.

We may be hilarious, hard-working, endlessly apologetic, and so good looking it should be illegal, but underneath we, like anyone else in the world, are human.

This Torontoist post is a nearly perfect encapsulation of how I and many others here feel about the whole ridiculous mess. Everyone loses.

http://torontoist.com/2010/06/g20_dispatches_everyone_loses.php

(Even with all of this, don't let one weekend of buffonery stop you from moving here. We make a mean plate of poutine.)

[Marsha]

I think this showed, and past G8/20 demos have shown, that the police are not a neutral force, but politicized with their own agenda. I really don't think the Canadian police are any different than other police forces unfortunately.

There were, once again, folks there demonstrating with an agenda to destroy (generally known as black bloc people).

And alas, when the police let them destroy property so the police then have an excuse to arrest hundreds of people and justify the massive amounts of money spent--the most ever spent on security for a G8/20 meeting, it can look like this small group of protesters--it really is such a small group of people--are bigger than they really are and that's our media will focus on. It's frustrating beyond belief.

[Moxie]

Neil, that post was awesome.

I just wish the whole weekend had never happened, aside from my 5 viewings of The Fantastic Mr. Fox.

[Anonymous this time]

I felt the same way, but I also thought, you know, those police are used to dealing with Canadians, not the freakazoids who come out of the woodwork for stuff like this. (NOT that Canadians weren't among them, but point is: this is not normal Toronto rush hour behavior.) I still breathe deep and think of Canada when things start getting scary here in the US.

[Linda]

I am not sure what to think about the whole situation. I am embarresed about the handling of the situation, but the protestors pissed me off so badly that it's hard to be angry with the police.
I think most of the Torontonians I talked to, knew it would be bad and would avoid the whole downtown scene until it was over. So the fact that there were innocent bystanders down there is puzzling because it would seem that every rational person knew to stay away, that it was not safe and the police did not have good control. The downtown was pretty shut down and paralyzed from my understanding, but I have not watched all the reports that you have.

Canada is no different from any other country, there's just less people. I think for the most part Canadians appreciate peace and respect authority. And we take better care of the poor than most countries which makes the country safer, and that is ironic considering what the protestors are protesting.

The civil right violation is horrific and I realize a lot of innocent people got screwed, but aside from military presence how can a city even handle that?

The next summit should be convened over Skype.

[Dr. Confused]

I'm with Neil.

I'm Canadian; I've lived in Canada and the States and am now in Europe.

Canadians, like Americans and British and French and etc etc are mostly lovely people and I adore them. But one thing that many of them have in common that has really started to drive me nuts is a smugness about their country. There's this myth that Canadians are so much better than Americans, more polite, more reasonable, more moderate, just nicer people. And that our country is one of the good ones, out there doing wonderful things in the world. It blinds a lot of people to Canada's failings. Canada is just another messed-up country trying to make it's way in this messed-up world. Yes, we've done great things. We are also routinely called out by Amnesty International and the UN for our shoddy treatment of First Nations people. And we have violent elements, and we have some poor police policy, etc, etc.

Please don't make Canada into some kind of a fantasyland. You may like it better in some ways (the major thing is that the centre in Canada is significantly left of the centre in the US, so gay marriage is legal everywhere, abortion rights are guaranteed and pretty much not up for discussion, and universal healthcare is sacred) but it is populated and run by imperfect human beings.

[caramama]

Okay, okay. Canada can be just as screwed up as the US, even with the exceptionally good looking people...

Scandinavia/the Nordic Countries! That's where we should go if things get too bad here! ;-)

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Bad for you. Do you think the social media with replace the TV media, radio media.

[Nikita]

I think perhaps you suohld check out what you say in this story. As I understand it, the building is near the double roundabout, the timber yard, bakery, shops, newsagent etc. Hardly a residential area. Also I believe that it is a drug & alcohol service not a rehab centre .These people are trying to get off of drink and drugs, there are also plans for support groups for family and carer. It is in addition to the services offered at Lewisham High Street. Do you really think that people want to be seen coming in and out of these places? They will probably come in, go to their session then go home. I wonder where the Brockley Society and these action groups were when the plans for the Bookies at Adelaide Avenue went into Lewisham Council even though there was a bookies straight over the road. And the amount of bars that are opening up in the area selling alcohol!I wish Brockley residents would get down of their high horses and HELP these people who are asking for help instead of trying to block plans to help those less fortunate get a service they need. There is the Darmouth Road service too, no real increase in drug or alcohol problems there.I was at the consultation at St Peters, I was disgusted to be included in the group of residents. I was disgusted at the way some of the action groups spoke to the Council people who had come to discuss the consultation. It was verging on a personal vendetta against the manager who was trying her best to answer all the questions bombarded at her.Go to a consultation and LISTEN WITHOUT PREJUDICE!

[ANA]

Here is a report of the bckograund to the case. It is important that the spotlight remains fixed on Centerprise, and that the council are reminded of the high esteem in which the bookshop is held. I would urge everyone to continue to support the campaign and get in touch you can find contact details here. GA_googleAddAttr("AdOpt", "1"); GA_googleAddAttr("Origin", "other"); GA_googleAddAttr("theme_bg", "0f0f0f"); GA_googleAddAttr("theme_border", "222222"); GA_googleAddAttr("theme_text", "bbbbbb"); GA_googleAddAttr("theme_link", "#d51a6e"); GA_googleAddAttr("theme_url", "#d51a6e"); GA_googleAddAttr("LangId", "1"); GA_googleAddAttr("Autotag", "books"); GA_googleAddAttr("Tag", "babylon"); GA_googleAddAttr("Tag", "history-ancestry"); GA_googleAddAttr("Tag", "centerprise"); GA_googleFillSlot("wpcom_sharethrough"); Share this:TwitterFacebookLike this:LikeBe the first to like this post. This entry was posted in Babylon, History & Ancestry and tagged Centerprise by Lester Holloway. Bookmark the permalink.

[Jordan]

As another rendiest of the island that Wapping will become, I agree wholly with David Leonard in his interview piece. However, I think the problem goes even further it is not only about getting out of Wapping to the East, it is about getting into Wapping from the West!The only way of doing this is going to be to find one's way to the top of Dock St (Royal Mint St, Cable St or Leman St all of which jam very easily) and then travel down Dock St and across into Vaughan Way. It will not only be cars trying to do this but the many trucks which service the businesses in the area.This walling in of Wapping could be avoided if either the Commercial Rd or Whitechapel Rd had been chosen as the primary axis for access to the Olympic area. Also, if either of those had been chosen, regular traffic seeking to avoid the selected route could move either North or South of it. With East Smithfield/The Highway, there is no moving south alternative.This really must be re-thought.Paul Garwood

[Suresh]

Hi David and Kathy, My husband and I are Canadian and arirved in the Dordogne region three years ago. I'd be happy to exchange a few emails comparing things. It has been interesting to say the least. Number One mistake we made was not getting a Saskatchewan or Quebec drivers license before leaving Canada. You can just swap either one of those for a French license. Any other province and you have to do the full French driving exam in French within one year. They say there is an abbreviated test of just 20 road signs you need to know, but somehow no one could tell us when it would be scheduled in the Dordogne. One could not just show up and complete it but go on a scheduled date, which only happened when enough people wanted to do it. Very chicken and egg. I love it here though and won't return to Canada if I can help it. Pam

[Achi]

I am deeply diutrsbed by Joe Paraskeva's situation. There is so much that is wrong about this case. Joe being able to get hold of a lighter whilst under a mental health section, with all the bizarre and unjust twists of the judicial system and IPP sentence he has received. He is a young man in desperate need of treatment and mental health support. He is obviously not a criminal and therefore should not be in prison. I think that not only is this very worrying for Joe and his family but for the wider public too, especially as one in four people suffer from some mental health illness during a life time. I believe that Joe should be immediately transferred to a psychiatric unit so he can be cared for properly, receiving the appropriate treatment.

[Gergana]

We are from Kanata, Ontario. We moved here in 1995, having taken early reeirtment, and we have never regretted it. Great place and great people who took us into their hearts very quickly. Canadians are considered something special to French people. Our French is far better than when we arrived!I agree with the need to get a driver's licence from Quebec or Saskatchewan; simple to do with advice.We are very happy to help others settle here too from Canada. Do put us in touch with David and Kathy please; and with Pam. we are happy to take telephone calls also at 33 5 65 21 20 07.Richard

[Alonzzo]

2. Edited: I am a man of many trades over the years. I stertad out as a fisherman many years ago and kept that up in many areas ground fishing. Hand line, Trawl and Fish dragger, from there I went back to a job which raised my family for most of there growing years digging, Shucking and selling Clams. Among those years I had a couple accidents and ended up on CPP Disability so I was around 35 to 37 when I went back to School, first GED and then Community College. I went for two years in Electronics and got a diploma in both years One & Two. General electronics and advanced TV electronics. I also took a course in PC repair.3. From their I took Web Design with IBDE and CSSD just general web design and I would like to take the advanced in it but I’m getting too old so now I’m writing and have one book published with blurb and will soon do another as I have about three or four already written but need some setting up and editing. I’m just having it hard to get funds to get some books from blurb Book Smart for my local area as there are many who want my books but won’t pay all the shipping etc that go with buying one. On disability where am I to get funds to buy a hundred book published in the US. I thought there was a place in Canada as well but never was able to find it.4. I did get one copy from them in black and white and it cost more ot get it shipped than the book costs. The books are reasonably priced but just too far away unless I can get a large bunch at a really good discount. There should be a Printer in Canada to do the printing so it would not cost so much..Can you help in any way at all or steer me in the right direction ?

[Aleman]

the puritanical girl who will not even dare to write the > word sh*t whuiott using an asterisk.I never understood that. Why is it less offensive to use an asterisk? Everybody knows exactly what you mean. Swearing has its place. It's supposed to be big! bold! it's supposed to offend!I mean, are people supposed to read sh*t and think, Wow, what a nice person. She's conveniently taken out the vowel so I won't be subjected to the full horror of the word. Now I'll only get moderately offended instead of truly offended.

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